Comments: Mary: Hope and Grace in Christ

“In view of her vocation to be the mother of the Holy One (Luke 1:35), *we can affirm together* that Christ's redeeming work reached 'back in Mary to the depths of her being, and to her earliest beginnings. This is not contrary to the teaching of Scripture, and can only be understood in the light of Scripture. Roman Catholics can recognize in this what is affirmed by the dogma - namely 'preserved from all stain of original sin' and 'from the first moment of her conception.'”

The problem w/ this dogma (Immaculate Conception) is not WHAT is says about Mary. It is that the Vatican proclaims that this is true ONLY of Mary.

It is the splitting-off of Mary from ordinary humanity (w/ the consequences of what that would then mean for Christ as "fully God/fully human") that so many non-RCs (probably a few RCs too?) find objectionable.

Posted by J. C. Fisher at Friday, 20 May 2005 at 2:28am BST

All the other ARCIC documents are readily available on the web. Why is this nice new one not? :(

Posted by Thomas Bushnell, BSG at Friday, 20 May 2005 at 8:30am BST

"All the other ARCIC documents are redily available on the web. Why is this nice new one not? :("

Don't know, but it is published in book form by Continuum/Morehouse. Ironic that it was probably supplied by the group to the publisher in an electronic format that we all could have downloaded and read for nothing. A real disappointment.

Posted by Rob Leduc at Friday, 20 May 2005 at 8:38pm BST

What's the matter? Don't you enjoy reading a bunch of documents about an unavailable document? :)

Posted by Scott Knitter at Saturday, 21 May 2005 at 4:02am BST

According to John Allen of the National Catholic Reporter at

"Mary: Grace and Hope in Christ will be available on-line by the end of May on the Vatican Web site."

This is broadly consistent with what Thinking Anglicans has been told, from the Anglican side of the discussion, about the publication of the full text.

Posted by Simon Sarmiento at Saturday, 21 May 2005 at 5:56pm BST

In addition to the Vatican site, the document is also available in both English and French on "Ecumenism in Canada / Oecuménisme au Canada" at

I have posted this document online by permission of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity. As far as I know, the text will eventually appear on the site of the Centro Pro Unione which has an excellent resource on the ARCIC dialogue.

Posted by Nicholas Jesson at Wednesday, 8 June 2005 at 7:07pm BST
Post a comment

Remember personal info?

Please note that comments are limited to 400 words. Comments that are longer than 400 words will not be approved.

Cookies are used to remember your personal information between visits to the site. This information is stored on your computer and used to refill the text boxes on your next visit. Any cookie is deleted if you select 'No'. By ticking 'Yes' you agree to this use of a cookie by this site. No third-party cookies are used, and cookies are not used for analytical, advertising, or other purposes.